Chekhov MacGuffin

By the way heliotropic, the anonymous user who added the info about Rum's voice on the computer being female is known for digging up unreliable info. It might be true but I haven't seen the source so I removed the statement for the time being. -edit to remove unneeded complaining-

I'd like to remind everyone that this case proves the Black Organization is aware of the decoding of Kohji's dying message "ASACA RUM" and is paranoid anything that sounds related to it.

.... Gosho, I can't believe you went there. -___________________________- Kabe don = "Wall bam" in English. It's basically a slang term for that trapping-someone-with-one-hand-against-the-wall pose that doesn't make sense without cultural knowledge. Jimmy, you might try "Akai trapping Scotch against the wall (heart)"

I think you are projecting too many of your own feelings and personality on her character to make conclusions rather than looking at the evidence. Haibara as a character, unlike Ran, doesn't revolve around Shinichi/Conan. Haibara draws almost as much strength from Ayumi and the DB and their pep talks as she does from Conan. She also enjoys being around Agasa and the DB, as she goes with them all of the time without complaint (unlike Conan who wishes he was an adult and knocks their kiddy interests at regular intervals). No evidence in the manga suggests the contrary.

I think Haneda Kouji's death by APTX is the real deal. I have no idea what Gosho is referring to honestly. Silly question, but does Gosho actually even know the meaning of "red herring?" Is the phrase for it in Japanese connote the same as in English? Yes.

One thing that has been bothering me is that this case has shown absolutely no connection to Haneda Kouji. For all we know ASACA stands for the Atlantic Shipping And Climbing Association and the 17 years ago timing is a complete coincidence. And speaking of shipping we have another career group with skill in lifting and rope manipulation. The annoying reporter, assuming he is being truthful about his skills, would be out of the suspect pool if he can't knot.

Yep, but only Conan complains about it. Ai seems content. She especially seems to like playing Agasa's diet minder, enough to put silly emoticons in her messages.

I sent someone this in a message, but I suppose it is relevant here. My opinion is that the boss will be male. Gosho follows a simple rule 3 times out of 4: a woman will have a man in her circle of people who interact with her who is on average more competent. Competence is measured as the ability to solve cases, make plans, outsmart opposition, or command a dangerous situation. Proves the rule Ran <-- Shinichi Ai/Shiho <-- Conan Ayumi <-- Conan Sonoko <-- Kaitou Kid, Makoto, Shinichi Yukiko <-- Yuusaku Kazuha <-- Heiji Sumiko <-- Shiratori Azusa <-- Amuro, Kogoro/Conan Masumi <-- Shuukichi, Shuuichi, Shinichi Yui <-- Kansuke, Koumei Jodie <-- Shuuichi Kir <-- Shuuichi, Ethan, Shinichi Chianti <-- Gin Aoko <-- Kaito Chikage <-- Toichi Akako <-- Kaito About even or in violation (and note that for all of these but Naeko, the woman has been in trouble more times than the man has and needed rescuing.) Eri <-- Kogoro Sato <-- Takagi Naeko <-- Chiba Vermouth <-- Gin, Akai, Bourbon Character pairs we don't know enough about: Shizuka and Heizo, Mary and Mr. Akai/Shuuichi Vermouth is likely less competent than the boss, so to prove the rule that boss would be male. If the boss is top in competency then only a male boss would avoid violating the rule.

You mean the Akai family? My main point is that the Shiho's circumstances after the fall of the BO would not be helped by being an adult. All the big fish might be arrested or killed, but that doesn't mean all of the associates will be nabbed right away. Even if you had fantasy 100% police efficiency all the bad guys must first go through court. And while we are on the topic of crime, it's highly possible Shiho herself may be charged with crimes. She did create a killer drug and the police can't really overlook that. Worst case scenario she has the whole book thrown at her and she ends up in jail for decades, best case scenario she is offered amnesty in exchange for testimony, but she will most likely be forced into witness protection to protect her from her former BO colleagues getting favors from criminals outside of jail and angry members of the public. Either way, Shiho would be under the control of a prosecutor who cares more about getting the bad guys for the sake of his career and justice than properly protecting an ex-bad guy and her secrets. The likelihood of her having normal "real life" after all of this is very low because she will be in jail or in hiding from pissed off ex-BO. If Shiho remains a child she would at least have the card up her sleeve of being practically unprosecutable, but still able to offer testimony while controlling when and where she is seen as Shiho by using temporary antidotes. It would reduce the risk to Agasa and the Detective Boys. It also lets her choose how to atone, rather than a prosecutor with different priorities. Perhaps later she might choose to take the antidote, but I fully expect DC to end without her taking it right away. There isn't a good reason for immediate reversion.

Shiho doesn't exactly have a life as an adult. Everyone she loved is dead and most of the people who know her want her dead for defecting. As a child she actually has a real life with Agasa, whom she likes as a father figure and doesn't find boring because they have similar interests. Unlike Conan, she actually seems to like school because she never had a school life as a real child. Ai talked about the crushing loneliness of that once, eating alone while being rushed through grade levels and college. I doubt the Black Organization will crumble down neatly. If she returns to being an adult, she will likely have to go into hiding and leave Tokyo, or Japan altogether, to avoid the retribution of the Black Organization's partners. Traitors are hated most of all. I don't see why people think Shinichi will stop visiting as an adult. He hung out with Agasa pretty frequently before he shrunk. Why would he revert to his arrogance after all the mental growing up as a fake child? Sure Shinichi will go to college/get a job eventually but Ai has plenty of time to work out what she wants.

There are subs out for this "no laughing detective agency" episode now. Also this clip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmZgVdqZgKY

I said this on the cbox, but I'll repeat here. My working theory is that Akai knew Scotch was an infiltrator but not vice versa. Akai didn't feel comfortable telling Scotch for whatever reason, the typical Akai behavior. Either Bourbon or Scotch slipped (my opinion is Bourbon) and Scotch took the fall for it. Akai went to confront him and revealed his FBI allegiance (The scene where Akai is kabe-don-ning Scotch. Scotch looks panicked because he still thinks Akai is loyal BO at that point in the convo, even though it's obvious a loyal BO wouldn't let Scotch do whatever with a gun while hovering so close they are breathing each others' air ._.). They formed a last minute plan to get Scotch killed in a way that would hide his identity and allow Bourbon to continue. Akai promises Scotch not to reveal Bourbon made the mistake that led up to all of this. Meanwhile Akai regrets not forming an allegiance with Scotch and working together before everything went south because maybe Scotch could have escaped alive. (The reason I don't think that Akai got there after Scotch shot himself is because there is no blood spatter on Akai yet.) Thoughts on the murder case Rokumichi almost certainly wears contacts/glasses. The harsh face he makes while squinting and the lack of it when his vision was corrected is what caused the change in his face and image. There was no way Rokumichi was hanged on that rope. That knot doesn't slide to cinch tight like a noose knot. Rokumichi could have easily slipped out if lifted into the air alive. That means he was probably dead before he was hanged on that rope. He must have been killed on the ground and then his dead body was hauled into the air. Okiya speculated you need a huge person to do so, but with proper rope techniques, it is easily possible for a regular size person to hoist a greater weight. The use of various rope configurations (and optionally pulleys) can reduce the force needed to haul a person upwards significantly. That's why mountaineering in relevant to this case, it's the source of the rope know-how. As an example, the simplest configuration, giving a 2:1 mechanical advantage, would be tie down the non-body end of the main rope, then attach a sliding rope winch to the middle of the main rope and pull it. The exact rope configuration details though (and why those chairs are relevant at all) are still unclear to me. The baseball was was used to get the hanging rope over a stage beam so the body could be hauled upward. The thick rope can't be thrown over the high beam by itself, so a string is tried to the non-looped end of the thick rope, the string is tied to the ball, and the ball tossed over the beam. The string is then reeled in to pull the end of the thick rope up and over. Why the murderer didn't recover the ball and string by tugging on it is a mystery to me. Also the vic's sunglasses are missing. He was wearing them in the movie, but not seen with them later. Edit: One thing I forgot is that many people are accusing Amuro of irrationally hanging on to his resentment after finding out Akai didn't kill Scotch in cold blood because Amuro now thinks that Akai could have gotten Scotch out of the situation alive. While I don't disagree about Amuro being rather unreasonable, remember Akai did pull off a fabulous fake death plan so Amuro's frustration is sort of justified. Amuro just doesn't know Conan was the mastermind. Sometimes people just become hysterical when someone they deeply care about dies, and unfortunately Gosho seems portray the feeling ham-handedly to the detriment of the likability of the character. Jodie's complete loss of composure, independence, and detective skill when Akai died is a prime example.

To be honest, I think you picked all the wrong examples to make your points. Those nameless guys might be goons, but they are pretty central to the episodes they are in. They aren't too numerous that they muck up things either. I don't think a blanket policy against nameless characters would work well in cases like The NY case, The Mysterious Passenger, or the Teito Bank Heist. In those cases, unnamed characters had major speaking roles. I also don't mind the animals in the people section. Most of the time they are effectively main case characters. I don't have a problem with repetition either if it helps with clarity. Different cases have different needs and multicase pages often have separate cast lists for each major case part. See Red vs Black for the most dramatic example. I went and removed the final people list on the first episode page because resolution sections on other pages don't have cast lists. I suspect the editor who added it wanted to make sure the weapon smuggler was represented somewhere on the episode page.

I personally feel many of the cast lists are being packed to the point of detracting from the main contributing characters in the movie and potentially confusing people unfamiliar with series or the site. In the same vein, I have been having misgivings about the unorganized overloaded state of some of the people sections which makes it impossible to tell who is relatively important with a lot of air time (like the suspects) and who isn't. (eg Movie 15, Movie 13) I am of the opinion that the wiki should operate like an onion in layers of detail, keeping the basic information most people are looking for front and center while sectioning or spinning off pages of increasing detail and "fancruft". I see the appearances page for each character as the proper location for the full laundry list of all appearances major and background. I am not happy with the status quo of mentioning background characters which don't add to the plot (or characters that only appear in the standard DC movie intro) in the cast list. I am not sure how I feel about minor recurring characters on the cast list. One one hand they are recurring characters which is a bit noteworthy even if no one cares about them. On the other hand, I feel like we are almost Conan IMDb in terms of our cast lists, and either need to choose between going there completely or backing away. Another concern is that a single user has done most of the discovery work regarding the the incredibly minor police and other background characters. No one has validated that person's work or proven that the characters are consistently the same character versus recycled models from earlier episodes. Despite my personal feelings, I won't unilaterally make a decision here without knowing the general opinion on the status quo.

The last name situation comes to mind first. Masumi Sera seems to be originally called Masumi Akai per the reaction to the convo in the red woman case. http://forums.dctp.ws/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=13071&start=135#p864674 Updated translation with corrections

I think I was reading between the lines there rather than relying on what was said exactly. You are technically right, we don't know how Shuukichi feels about Kohji other than deep respect for Shogi skills.

If we make the reaching assumptions that 1) all the APTX-like drugs developed have the same effect including the one that Vermouth took whenever, 2) That effect is to decrease age and then stop aging to lock in the new younger body, that raises some questions about Vermouth. If Mary was middle age (let's say ~50-55) and she turned into a middle schooler, then Vermouth must have been a veritable crone to turn ~25ish.

Eh, Gosho has said plenty of revealing things like this in past at these talks and elsewhere like in postcards. I don't think a new silhouette is out of character. I have one hundred percent the opposite opinion. I'm looking at the detailed hairline, the dress, a chest shape that implies enormous boobs, and thinking there is way more detail than needed for a one-off drawing or pose. https://i.imgur.com/wJSKNR3.jpg Gosho even went so far as to put a giant question mark by the silhouette, as if saying "guess who I am! w"

I am aware of the context of the slide, but I think it is effectively an announcement that a character from SIS/MI6 will be involved. Just because Gosho doesn't make the slides doesn't mean he doesn't decide the content. None of the other groups on that slide are hypotheticals, and given the sudden bout of Britishness that has been going on, I think the writing is on the wall. No one has fronted an idea who shadow woman is either. Gosho typically reuses the images he makes for keyholes, and none of the keyholes match the shadow figure as far as I know. It's far more detailed than a generic shadowperson.

Stopped my bedroom from catching on fire. A light on an electrical timer randomly shorted and started an electrical fire. I shut it off and got the fire out before it spread, but I felt a hell of a lot safer knowing I had an extinguisher in fifteen feet if it relit. So get a fire extinguisher. Also reminder you need to back your comp data up.

Bumping this topic with copypasta. Sorry. Mary is one of those overly suspicious but obviously fake suspects that Gosho uses to confuse the people who are new to his style and haven't seen his tricks before. Masumi overtly calls Mary mom, which makes two things pretty likely: Mary is a shrunken person and Mary spawned the Akai litter. That changes a lot of things as far as reasonable suspicion goes. Mary is not Asaka or Rum. 1) Haneda Kouji was the close friend of Shuukichi, and killing your kid's best friend would be pretty bad. 2) Okiya/Shuuichi seems to be worried about the presence of Asaka lurking around Masumi, meaning Asaka sounds like a bad deal. While the Akai family clearly has all sorts of problems, an evil mom doesn't seem to be one of them based on Mary's interactions with Masumi. Mary also helped Conan nail a killer. 3) No moves have been made against Conan or Haibara even though Mary knows Conan used to be Shinichi (she compares Conan to that kid from the past). Shinichi is supposed to be dead, and Haibara said that she couldn't tell the BO of Shinichi's survival because they would kill him before she could study him. 4) Mary is on the run and hiding from someone. The BO have great resources in Japan and know how to disappear. A top BO agent wouldn't need to do something as primitive as shuffle hotels while putting Masumi through public school. That leaves all sorts of records law enforcement can compel hotels to hand over. That suggests that Mary's enemy is not Japanese law enforcement. 5) The hints are suggesting Mary is most likely Elena's sister. (She looks like Haibs, Gosho mentioned a mother character has a mother sister.) Elena was nice, even though BO. 6) During his yearly talk, Gosho announced the presence of MI6/SIS with a new female character's silhouette. Guess who enjoys British-style tea in her hotel and has a tomboy child who speaks the Queen's English and has British table manners? Mary.

Rum could be loyal like Gin and a jack of all trades but a master of none. I am a bit of a fan of the idea that Rum could have a gadget replacing his eye that could give him extra perception like infrared vision or something. The BO clearly has some level of gadgeteering and talent, but Gosho hasn't explored the idea of an enemy with Agasa-like powers. Agasa is pretty high up in Team Shin-chan, so why not an evil Agasa? Mary is one of those overly suspicious but obviously fake suspects that Gosho uses to confuse the people who are new to his style and haven't seen his tricks before. Masumi overtly calls Mary mom, which makes two things pretty likely: Mary is a shrunken person and Mary spawned the Akai litter. That changes a lot of things as far as reasonable suspicion goes. 1) Haneda Kouji was the close friend of Shuukichi, and killing your kid's best friend would be pretty bad. 2) Okiya/Shuuichi seems to be worried about the presence of Asaka lurking around Masumi, meaning Asaka sounds like a bad deal. While the Akai family clearly has all sorts of problems, an evil mom doesn't seem to be one of them based on Mary's interactions with Masumi. Mary also helped Conan nail a killer. 3) No moves have been made against Conan or Haibara even though Mary knows Conan used to be Shinichi (she compares Conan to that kid from the past). Shinichi is supposed to be dead, and Haibara said that she couldn't tell the BO of Shinichi's survival because they would kill him before she could study him. 4) Mary is on the run and hiding from someone. The BO have great resources in Japan and know how to disappear. A top BO agent wouldn't need to do something as primitive as shuffle hotels while putting Masumi through public school. That leaves all sorts of records law enforcement can compel hotels to hand over. That suggests that Mary's enemy is not Japanese law enforcement. 5) The hints are suggesting Mary is most likely Elena's sister. (She looks like Haibs, Gosho mentioned a mother character has a mother sister.) Elena was nice, even though BO. 6) During his yearly talk, Gosho announced the presence of MI6/SIS with a new female character's silhouette. Guess who enjoys British-style tea in her hotel and has a tomboy child who speaks the Queen's English and has British table manners? Mary.