Classic Cinema Colloquy

[Kyuu Nye 425]

So, this is basically coming from the M15 thread and a bit of debate over action vs story.

Hollywood has been making videos for over a century now, and in that time they have made more than a few timeless classics and just other fantastic movies that may be a bit dated, but still get the message across in a meaningful and impactful way. Now the problem is that is ISN'T just Hollywood doing this, so it is unfair to limit this thread to the realm of American cinema, so we shall discuss all forms of great and classic cinema, be it from Europe, Asia, India... Doesn't matter.

Now, "classic" in terms of cinema can be broken down into two main categories, and several sub categories (I won't get into the sub categories unless it comes up in the normal discourse). The main two are "Classic works of cinema" and "Modern Classics." Both have one big thing in common, which is that you can watch them time and time again and they don't get old, no matter when you watch them (in other words, if the movie came out in the 1960's, watching it in 2011 doesn't change your experience of the movie).

The reason why I have to include both is because a lot of people don't consider movies that came out in the 90s and 2000s to be classics (hell people often extend that into the 80s too), but there ARE some.

So lets get this started! I'd feel inclined to start with a nice easy one...

The Shawshank Redemption. The story of an innocent man who is sent to prison for double murder, and his adventures in prison. Andy Dufresne (Tim Robbins), the title character, must make the best of his time in prison. It has more than a few powerful messages that it conveys masterfully. It is a fantastic movie, and one which I cannot recommend enough. Especially since it was made in 1994, it is fairly modern, though it is set in 1940s.

Here is the theatrical trailer:

"Get busy living, or get busy dying"

Open spoiler for side notes

I would not mind at all if this thread also went into directors, writers and producers. Talking about the great men behind the movies is as much cinematic discussion as is talking about the movies themselves. Naturally this would include talking about how the actors dealt with their roles in the respective movies.

I don't care about genre. All I care about is that people learning and talking about great movies, well known or not. Epic tales, moving dramas, great adventures... However, STORY MUST BE PARAMOUNT! Naturally that includes animated features

I'm sure DR, CC, Waka and myself all want to cease being the minority caring about story over action. This thread is the beginning of that I hope. I hope that every movie that is discussed or recommended is watched by every user of this site. If all goes well, not a bad movie will be mentioned in this thread.

Lastly... For the record, I used colloquy in the title on purpose, because it sounds cooler than discussion, also more intelligent! That and I'm getting tired of seeing "discussion" all the time.

[Detective Rohit 38]

Thanks I was waiting for this I wanted people to know what REAL movies are.

We all know World War 2. But most of us do not know how destructive it was.

Starring Tom Hank, Saving Private Ryan was the first movie which actually shows how the condition of soldiers, be it American or German, were. The starting 24 minutes is what this movie is know for. Highly realsitic and very touching. It shows the harsh reality of war, without deleting any scenes.

This movie changed my life. No other movie has affected me so much as this. Must watch

[CarpetCrawler 280]

Brooks is the best character in that movie. His whole story about a man who has basically spent his entire life at Shawshank to the point where he felt like an outsider once he left to join the outside world was absolutely touching. "Brooks was here."

"Network" is probably my favorite film of all time. Amazing acting (Peter Finch is freakin' amazing) and lots of amazing messages that act as foreshadowing to how the world of television is these days. You owe it to yourself to see this film.

YouTube is great if you just want to see all of Finch's scenes. This movie is worth it alone for the LEGENDARY scene between Finch and Ned Beatty's character about how the world and battling nations are all merely a business. Was looking for my favorite scene in the entire movie... and thankfully I found it. <3 "We deal in illusions, none of this is true."

If you're a big fan of how television production works, you'll find this film fun just for that alone. For everyone else, it's a wonderful thinking man's movie, with some incredible acting. You really need to watch this film.

[Detective Rohit 38]

I can keep on adding movies to this topic! xD

Starring Tom Hanks again, Cast Away was yet another excellent movie released in 2000.

It delivers such a strong message of fear, survival and hope, that leaves your mind devoted to thinking about it for a long while after. It made me think about all my creature comforts, and what is actually necessary in life. Talking to a volleyball has never been more dramatic! I also loved the fact that there was little talking in the film, but anyway, it sort of made you guess how he was feeling, in a clever way. This is one of my all time favourite films, and I could watch it again and again without getting bored.

[Kyuu Nye 425]

Brooks is the best character in that movie. His whole story about a man who has basically spent his entire life at Shawshank to the point where he felt like an outsider once he left to join the outside world was absolutely touching. "Brooks was here."

"Network" is probably my favorite film of all time. Amazing acting (Peter Finch is freakin' amazing) and lots of amazing messages that act as foreshadowing to how the world of television is these days. You owe it to yourself to see this film.

YouTube is great if you just want to see all of Finch's scenes. This movie is worth it alone for the LEGENDARY scene between Finch and Ned Beatty's character about how the world and battling nations are all merely a business. Was looking for my favorite scene in the entire movie... and thankfully I found it. <3 "We deal in illusions, none of this is true."

If you're a big fan of how television production works, you'll find this film fun just for that alone. For everyone else, it's a wonderful thinking man's movie, with some incredible acting. You really need to watch this film.

I actually cannot think of anyone in Shawshank that didn't have an important role or message to convey, no matter how big or little their part was. Brooks was an especially impactful story because he was "institutionalized." That scene was amazing, but honestly one of the most moving scenes was the Motzart opera scene. That also highlighted one of the best underplayed messages of the film. While most people latch on to hope, or living life to the fullest, that scene and the subsequent scenes, is basically saying that freedom comes from within, and there are things that no one can take from you so long as your mind is in the right place. And it is one of the few scenes where you saw the background actors and extras show an insane amount of emotion with just a passing glance of a panning shot.

I haven't checked out Network, but I have to say, that scene makes its own case for why I should watch it. I shall check it out as soon as I can.

@DR: If we really wanted to we probably could list movies all day and night and never run out of good ones for a long time. There are so many amazing movies out there that I don't think we CAN list them all...

[Dean Moriarty 1]

Great thread! But I have to disagree on these movies being timeless experiences, because the way people perceive movies has changed a lot.

For example: Rear Window by Alfred Hitchcock - shocked people in the 50s, leaves you rather unimpressed today, because as time went by, filmmakers were constantly pushing the boundaries of this genre.

Another example: Annie Hall by Woody Allen - has an average shot length of 14.5 seconds. Then MTV came up with music videos and today we have shot lengths that are significantly shorter. The pace of the narrative is faster in general. So, as we’re used to movies being told faster than those made in the 70s or earlier, we could get bored by narratives and shots that now seem unusually long.

Nevertheless, among these classics there are of course some, that I would consider timeless, but surely not all of them.

Now back on topic: I’ll start in the early days. And because I’m German, the first two movies I recommend are of the German expressionism period.

The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari (1920) – a silent horror film by Robert Wiene. This movie has influcenced recent works of Terry Gilliam (The Imaginarium of Dr. Parnassus) and Martin Scorsese (Shutter Island). However, it left its biggest impression on director Tim Burton, whose visual style is an extension of what you can see in this movie.

http://www.youtube.com/movie?v=ALqnSUMHPrA&ob=av4n

Metropolis (1927) – a movie by Fritz Lang. This movie is probably the first great sci-fi movie and the role model for Cyberpunk and movies like Blade Runner.

[Kyuu Nye 425]

Great thread! But I have to disagree on these movies being timeless experiences, because the way people perceive movies has changed a lot.

For example: Rear Window by Alfred Hitchcock - shocked people in the 50s, leaves you rather unimpressed today, because as time went by, filmmakers were constantly pushing the boundaries of this genre.

Another example: Annie Hall by Woody Allen - has an average shot length of 14.5 seconds. Then MTV came up with music videos and today we have shot lengths that are significantly shorter. The pace of the narrative is faster in general. So, as we’re used to movies being told faster than those made in the 70s or earlier, we could get bored by narratives and shots that now seem unusually long.

Nevertheless, among these classics there are of course some, that I would consider timeless, but surely not all of them.

Now back on topic: I’ll start in the early days. And because I’m German, the first two movies I recommend are of the German expressionism period.

The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari (1920) – a silent horror film by Robert Wiene. This movie has influcenced recent works of Terry Gilliam (The Imaginarium of Dr. Parnassus) and Martin Scorsese (Shutter Island). However, it left its biggest impression on director Tim Burton, whose visual style is an extension of what you can see in this movie.

http://www.youtube.com/movie?v=ALqnSUMHPrA&ob=av4n

Metropolis (1927) – a movie by Fritz Lang. This movie is probably the first great sci-fi movie and the role model for Cyberpunk and movies like Blade Runner.

Lol, I never said all of them "they have made more than a few timeless classics and just other fantastic movies that may be a bit dated, but still get the message across in a meaningful and impactful way" So yeah, I'm well aware not all of them are timeless. They have made quite a few of them though, certainly enough for me to say that.

Also I don't think Rear Window is that dated. Sure it doesn't have the same impact it did in the 50s, but the story is still strong and it is brilliantly told. People always push the boundaries of genres and try new things. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't. However that doesn't detract from the story or prevent people from using the ideas first presented in the Rear Window.

As for attention span, that is true... to a point. It depends on the audience. However, due to the large consensus it has become a film making practice to keep shots short in modern times. But there are still Avant Garde films that hold longer and try different things to screw with those perceptions that you speak of. And a lot of them are fantastic movies, if not for the story than the film practices employed.

Both of those movies you chose are amazing. I haven't seen either in a long while. Metropolis especially I have fond memories of. However, after reading up on it, I could never stop wondering if we were actually seeing the complete movie or not. That is the shame about a lot of older movies, especially from the silent era, they were sometimes heavily edited. And a lot of those edits were lost to the sands of time possibly never to be seen again. It doesn't help exactly that the film used at that time was highly flammable.

[Detective Rohit 38]

@DR: If we really wanted to we probably could list movies all day and night and never run out of good ones for a long time. There are so many amazing movies out there that I don't think we CAN list them all...

I wish we could.. I WANT people to watch all the great classics. Its hurts when i find some Transformer fan or a Harry Potter fan calling the movie "Best"...

And..dont call me DR.

[Southpaw 61]

And not every classic movie has to be a drama, just look at The Princess Bride

[Kyuu Nye 425]

And not every classic movie has to be a drama, just look at The Princess Bride

Alright you people are reading things that I never wrote... Don't know how or why.

Also the princess bride is awesome.

@detective, the Dr was a quick thing. I don't think I've ever called you that before.

Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk

[Detective Rohit 38]

And not every classic movie has to be a drama, just look at The Princess Bride

We are talking about excellent movies in general..Whatever type they maybe.

Alright you people are reading things that I never wrote... Don't know how or why.

Also the princess bride is awesome.

@detective, the Dr was a quick thing. I don't think I've ever called you that before.

Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk

Ah no, just call me Rohit, simple and short.

[Southpaw 61]

Alright you people are reading things that I never wrote... Don't know how or why.

I promise that I wasn't... I was just making the point that all the films people had mentioned so far were dramas

[kfnnapa 9]

I'm sorry, but how is it that no one has mentioned Star Wars yet.

Despite that fact I can agree that there are many people out there, including most of my friends, who like to see action more than story. I can even say that as we were watching Mr. Smith Goes to Washington in my Mythology class, most of the room was talking and only me and two other students were actually paying attention to the movie. It was a great film made in 1939 with James Stewart.

Also going back to Rear Window, I loved watching that movie. It may be old compared to what my classmates think, but I thoroughly enjoyed it. Hitchcock is the master of suspense, and I think the only other film of his that I liked more would be Rope. (I'm starting to sense a James Stewart trend)

A somewhat modern movie that I liked to watch because of how it makes you think is A Beautiful Mind. I'm not sure how to explain the plot without giving everything away. All I'll say is that it's something you'll watch twice, just so you can understand what was actually going on. I could literally go on and on with movies. I'm a huge movie guy and have anywhere from 550 to 650 DVDs in my house right now. I do have one more movie I enjoyed, The Hustler. My friends would die of boredome watching it. No action whatsoever. It's a 2 hour movie mostly about two people talking about their lives. It does have some pocket pool in it for those of you who actually enjoy watching pool like me.

[Dean Moriarty 1]

Also I don't think Rear Window is that dated. Sure it doesn't have the same impact it did in the 50s, but the story is still strong and it is brilliantly told. People always push the boundaries of genres and try new things. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't. However that doesn't detract from the story or prevent people from using the ideas first presented in the Rear Window.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s a really good movie and all. But judging from a modern perspective, I think it’s also slow-paced with very old-fashioned dialogue. If it wasn’t a genre-defining milestone, it wouldn’t make my list of must-see thrillers.

I also prefer Psycho, by the way.

Both of those movies you chose are amazing. I haven't seen either in a long while. Metropolis especially I have fond memories of. However, after reading up on it, I could never stop wondering if we were actually seeing the complete movie or not. That is the shame about a lot of older movies, especially from the silent era, they were sometimes heavily edited. And a lot of those edits were lost to the sands of time possibly never to be seen again. It doesn't help exactly that the film used at that time was highly flammable.

Oh, then did you hear about the missing pieces, that were recovered from an old copy they found in Buenos Aires?

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/05/movies/05metropolis.html

I promise that I wasn't... I was just making the point that all the films people had mentioned so far were dramas

Sure? Network is a satire, Caligari is horror, Metropolis is sci-fi

I’ll leave the 1920s with another two recommendations.

The General (1926) – by Buster Keaton. Simply because Buster Keaton is incredible.

The Battleship Potemkin (1925) – by Sergei Eisenstein. It’s a Russian propaganda piece based on Eisenstein’s theories about montage. It’s very famous for the Odessa Steps sequence, which is referenced in The Godfather, The Untouchables, The Simpsons and lots of others.

[Detective Rohit 38]

We grow, we learn more things and we become mature. We loose our childhood as we grow up. This is what is shown in this movie. Yes i am talking about Toy Story 3. Even if you are 18+, this movie will sure appeal you. it shows how tough growing up is.

[Kyuu Nye 425]

We grow, we learn more things and we become mature. We loose our childhood as we grow up. This is what is shown in this movie. Yes i am talking about Toy Story 3. Even if you are 18+, this movie will sure appeal you. it shows how tough growing up is.

Not really a classic.... but.... I cannot deny that it is a fantastic movie and possibly the perfect end to the franchise.