File 818-824: Mystery Train (NO SPOILER)

[Black Demon 466]

Or perhaps Akai knew that "Sherry" was Kid from the start and knew he would be able to get away. I was under the impression that Subaru / Akai knew that Haibara was safe and sound from the beginning. Back at the climax of the Vermouth arc when Vermouth made a run for it and took Conan as hostage, he didn't shoot her because he's the type of guy who doesn't want to hurt the good guys in the process of taking down the Black Org guys.

Akai most likely knows about the plan, since the readers DO know that this is just a trick. What's more important is how Amuro's gonna think about the situation.

[Chekhov MacGuffin 1089]

Akai most likely knows about the plan, since the readers DO know that this is just a trick. What's more important is how Amuro's gonna think about the situation.

Amuro is going to wonder why some guy bothered to throw a grenade under him when he was cornering Sherry and if it was part of a trap. Assuming he didn't get a clear look at the Akai and thus does not know the man's identity, Amuro knows or will know shortly that he wasn't Vermouth. If the man meant to kill him, a grenade would be less ideal than a gun because it gives Amuro a better chance to escape. (and he did) [My assumption is a man who has grenades in Japan probably also has a gun.] From Amuro's point of view, it would be someone also aiming to kill Shiho or a trap. Besides a trick, I suppose it is also possible Amuro could come to conclusion that it was another Organization member or Vermouth brought in someone else to make sure Shiho died. It seems though that by asking for Akai's files, he is worried about the former.

[D.ai-kun 1]

I'm curious about why Amuro wanted to bring Shiho back to the BO (alive). Should she continue the research on the APTX? Or does the Boss want to know how she escaped? Did Amuro really plan to bring her back to the BO or did he even want to "save" her and not harm her? He said he met Shiho's parents and sister so maybe it has something to do with them...? (But I think and hope he is evil...)

Any ideas?

[Kaitou Kid Legendary Thief 197]

I'm curious about why Amuro wanted to bring Shiho back to the BO (alive). Should she continue the research on the APTX? Or does the Boss want to know how she escaped? Did Amuro really plan to bring her back to the BO or did he even want to "save" her and not harm her? He said he met Shiho's parents and sister so maybe it has something to do with them...? (But I think and hope he is evil...)

Any ideas?

I am not sure whether what I understand is true (because I read the translated version - and translated means there could be some misunderstandings), but there was no mention of whether Bourbon is supposed to bring her back alive or not. I think the main purpose is to track her down and whether or not she is killed at the spot was not important. It could be that he wanted to ask her about Akai before she was killed or it could be something else altogether.

However, it is very clear that Vermouth wanted her dead, and Amuro didn't seem to agree with that, since he changed his mind for her be in the storage room after he found out that Vermouth had planted bombs in it.

Thing is, what was the original plan? It appears that the organization had planned this event of bombing together, but every one of them seems to have different ideas of how to deal with Sherry. I think the original plan was to have the train bombed at the final destination such that the passengers would believe it was a target on themselves so the main purpose (of targetting Sherry) could be hidden. Separating the train cabins seems to be a pre-planned event as well. If they meant to kill off Sherry, they wouldn't have to do that since it would have been done when they set off the bomb at the end. Well, it could be a preventive measure to kill her off in the last cabin before the bombing, but judging from Bourbon's actions, it doesn't seem like they have planned for that. So they might have decided to dispose of her somewhere else, or not planning to kill her off first for some reason.

I am more curious as to why Vermouth wanted so much for Shiho to be dead, which seems contradicting to her actions previously. Could it be, that what she wanted was not for Shiho to be dead, but "disappear"?

What I mean is that, could it be because there was something that Vermouth didn't want the organisation to find out about, so she had to dispose of her in a way that will convince the organisation that she is dead? No prove or whatsoever now though, just stating some of my thoughts.

Also, having Kaitou Kid there was a little unexpected for me as well (Even though I was a little happy about it XD). Looks like this is the first time Kaitou Kid appeared together and clashed with the Black Organization in the same event. XDDD

[Black Demon 466]

I am not sure whether what I understand is true (because I read the translated version - and translated means there could be some misunderstandings), but there was no mention of whether Bourbon is supposed to bring her back alive or not. I think the main purpose is to track her down and whether or not she is killed at the spot was not important. It could be that he wanted to ask her about Akai before she was killed or it could be something else altogether.

However, it is very clear that Vermouth wanted her dead, and Amuro didn't seem to agree with that, since he changed his mind for her be in the storage room after he found out that Vermouth had planted bombs in it.

Which translated version did you read ? I read both the Chinese and English versions and they both mention about Amuro's original plan in page 7 of file 824, that's he's gonna bring "her" back to the organization alive, and also prepared a helicopter for that as well. He's gonna separate that part of the train with explosive, and while that happens, Shiho/Kid would be safe inside the storage (he wanted to make "her" unconscious first), but unknowing to Amuro, Vermouth had set C4 in that storage to blow "her" up. After finding out about her scheme, he asked Shiho/Kid to come out and go with him but "she" refused to do so.

It might not have been The Boss' order or the plan of the Org., but Amuro did prepare for himself to capture Sherry alive.

[TML 18]

My guess is that Vermouth will preserve the status quo only if Sherry is in the company of one or more of her allies (which explains why she did not take action upon realizing that Ai was sleeping on Dr. Agasa's back). Otherwise, if Sherry were alone with Vermouth with no one else around, all bets are off.

[Kaitou Kid Legendary Thief 197]

Which translated version did you read ? I read both the Chinese and English versions and they both mention about Amuro's original plan in page 7 of file 824, that's he's gonna bring "her" back to the organization alive, and also prepared a helicopter for that as well. He's gonna separate that part of the train with explosive, and while that happens, Shiho/Kid would be safe inside the storage (he wanted to make "her" unconscious first), but unknowing to Amuro, Vermouth had set C4 in that storage to blow "her" up. After finding out about her scheme, he asked Shiho/Kid to come out and go with him but "she" refused to do so.

It might not have been The Boss' order or the plan of the Org., but Amuro did prepare for himself to capture Sherry alive.

The English one. And I have read that part that you were talking about.

According to D.ai-kun, "I'm curious about why Amuro wanted to bring Shiho back to the BO (alive)." My understanding of the statement is that ai-kun thought that Amuro wasn't supposed to bring her back alive, which led me to think that it might have been true (or maybe not).

It was clear that Bourbon's original plan was to bring her back alive, but it wasn't mentioned what was the original plan of the organization. They had been trying to kill her off ever since long time ago, so what was the change in decision? Was it really a change in decision or was it just Bourbon's plan? It was also mentioned that they would blow up the train when it reached the destination, so it could be that they had wanted to kill Shiho (there) in the first place.

EDITED:

Also, somewhere along page 12 of chapter 824, Vermouth stressed on something like this - "Aren't you satisfied with JUST Sherry being reduced to dust?".

I don't know if it means something, but it seems to me that they wanted to destroy Sherry and the entire train altogether when the train reached the station. Also, Gin did mention that if there was any explosion, the train would stop at the next station, when (to my understanding) they planned on blowing up the train at the final station. =\ Their plans really doesn't seem to match. Which is why the complication.

[primrose 3]

I'm curious about why Amuro wanted to bring Shiho back to the BO (alive). Should she continue the research on the APTX? Or does the Boss want to know how she escaped? Did Amuro really plan to bring her back to the BO or did he even want to "save" her and not harm her? He said he met Shiho's parents and sister so maybe it has something to do with them...? (But I think and hope he is evil...)

Any ideas?

I'm wondering about that, too. If it was the boss's order to bring Sherry back alive, then why wasn't Vermouth or Gin informed of it? I don't think they would have planned to blow up the train had the boss given a specific order to keep Sherry alive. It seems Bourbon was doing things by himself. But according to his own words he had other BO members on a helicopter following the train - how could such a thing be arranged without Vermouth noticing? There's something fishy about the Vermouth-Gin phone convo, too. We get no reaction from Gin at the news Sherry has been blown to pieces. Considering how much pleasure he'd been shown to derive from her suffering in vol 24, could he be that nonchalant about her death? So many questions.

[Akai1412 0]

Perhaps that, even though that Amuro's tests forced him to conclude that Akai is really dead, maybe he never really believed what his tests were telling him. If he knows there was a connection between Shiho and Akai, then he would want to preserve the connection and use Shiho as bait to lure out Akai. Gin said it before that Bourbon hates Akai more than he does, and if that's true, he will stop at nothing to find and eliminate Akai for himself; even if it means going against the boss' orders.

As for Gin's less than excited reaction to Shiho's "death", is that perhaps he doesn't trust that she had been killed effectively enough, and / or he doesn't trust Vermouth/Bourbon. That and he probably wanted to execute her himself.

[Detective Kudo 28]

Well i have been thinking what was it that kid owed conan for. Remember that eye case and kazuya saw that man dressed up and made the eye trick. As well as the maid who was aiding conan and company. Those two people where one in the same. It was actally kid asking for heiji and kudos help. This also makes me beleive that now in the canon kid may be suspicous of conans identity

[User 4869 100]

Interesting but i can't figured out the motive Kid would want to involve in the EYE case.

[Kaitou Kid Legendary Thief 197]

Well i have been thinking what was it that kid owed conan for. Remember that eye case and kazuya saw that man dressed up and made the eye trick. As well as the maid who was aiding conan and company. Those two people where one in the same. It was actally kid asking for heiji and kudos help. This also makes me beleive that now in the canon kid may be suspicous of conans identity

I think you missed the part in the manga. Kid is the one disguised as the maid pushing the lady in the wheelchair. Conan discovered it and made kid understand that he did not pressure him during the questioning even though he could have. If he did, kid would have been found out and perhaps cornered. This is what kid 'owed' him... I think.