Balthazar Manfredie 226 Report post Posted February 23, 2015 I Hate it when religion gets a bad rep for things its not mostly correct I have talked to several folks diff religion and asked them: "OK, if you were to take out the religious aspect of you, what are your thoughts about all this" The answers will not be written here, and there is no support from them to this community..in short Folks its not religion, give it a rest already 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Akazora 293 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 I'm so sorry for not adding anything to the discussion what have I done please delete this post if you feel the need to I just couldn't resist (not really my style to get mixed up in topics like this one, so I'll be bowing out now... carry on...) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 First and foremost I found this screencap of a tweet on tumblr and thought it was funny and still somewhat relevant as Akakata and I both fall on the ace spectrum Reveal hidden contents And though the topic's kinda progressed onwards I wanted to link this which is about a transgirl named Jazz. She was only 11 at the time of it being filmed and it's sad how young she was when she learned about all the...just ignorance the general public has regarding transgender people. It's also nice to hear about a family that fully accepts their child and is allowing her to transition so early on! On 2/23/2015 at 5:33 PM, Akakata said: Reveal hidden contents Okay, okay, so a lot has been going back and forth, and it sounds like some good stuff has been said. machine has said several good things that I agree with, and MK has said a few things I just like to point out/elaborate on!! These "gender norms" are constructs of society, and I honestly and thoroughly believe that we should not be teaching men to act in such a manner. There's nothing "weak" in regards to things that are considered more "feminine" such as crying, showing physical affection, and being more open about our feelings. In fact, I think those things can be extremely important when it comes to having effective communication between any two groups or more of people. Reveal hidden contents Second, those are only stereotypes and stereotypes leave a bad taste in my mouth. Please don't make any assumptions about this group of people. I understand that some members who identify as homosexual of the LGBTQA+ community can be flirty and overly dramatic, but so can any other group. And saying that you want to avoid that group of people solely because a few people can act in such a way is being discriminatory, but you seem to already understand that. Thirdly, I request that you don't continue to refer to the LGBTQA+ community as "gays". The LGBTQA+ community is filled with diverse orientations, not only homosexual people. It is incorrect to refer to us in such a way, and I personally find it extremely exclusive. How much more difficult is it to type LGBTQA+ over "gays"? Only a few letters. Thank you. Reveal hidden contents I know many religious people who still follow the church, well, religiously. It still has power, and always has been. Basically every single war in history has been fought because of religion, and it still has tremendous influence. And to say they get "no persecution" is an absolutely incorrect statement. Please look here, and feel free to google "hate crimes against lgbt" and see what comes up. Even if it'll "probably be hard to change" doesn't mean that we shouldn't try to dissuade use of that phrase, as some people in the community may be uncomfortable with it. It's the same as when using the phrase "that's so gay" offended many people, especially when it was used in regards to something that wasn't even human. And for that last part, can you blame them for being so focused on it and advocating for it? People are thrown out of their homes for coming out to their families, they're scared. People commit suicide because they feel like they can no longer continue to live with their gender identity. It is a pressing issue, one that should be brought to everyone's attention. And this is a huge aspect of their life, so of course they're going to talk about it! It's the same as you being passionate about something you like, such as Detective Conan, for instance. You want to talk about it with your friends because you really like it. It's the same, except this can BE their entire lives. Just something to keep in mind. Thanks! I agree with majority of what you said (and I bolded parts I found particularly important) so I don't have much to add. I would like to add a little to that last part though. It's that LGBTQIA+ people leave their house every day knowing some people hate them (some even want to physically harm them) solely based on their orientation, gender identity, and/or gender expression. For LGBTQIA+ teens it's knowing they could be kicked out, disowned, put into conversion therapy, and/or beaten simply for not being straight and/or cis. It's going to school every day and knowing there are undoubtedly kids there who wouldn't hesitant to bully you if you were out of the closet. It's having to be misgendered on a daily basis by your family because they can't fathom the idea of their beautiful daughter or son not being the gender they were assigned with at birth. It's knowing you could lose your job based over something you can't control. It's knowing you and your same gender significant other would not be safe visiting certain countries. It's knowing that in some countries being non het/cis is a crime and can land you in jail or even lead to you being killed. It's knowing just because of what your identity is you might be denied medical treatment. It's also knowing you're at a higher risk for certain mental illnesses including depression. It's living in fear. (main source: page 2 of this) It's not a pleasant thing to talk about but it needs to be discussed openly and frequently. These problems are fortunately going away slowly but surely but it's not an exaggeration to say some LGBTQIA+ people might not be able to hold out that long for things to change. It does get a little tiring to hear it over and over but it's not being reiterated just for the sake of being irritating. On 2/23/2015 at 9:25 PM, MK the Great said: Reveal hidden contents Well for the First, Honestly, I'm a bit of a showy guy too when it comes to emotion and feelings. So, I really have no prob about that. I also hope that guys are more like that than taking everything inside and never letting it out. It can kill, literally. For the second, well yeah, I was stereotyping. Sorry about that. Can't really just avoid it. Yeah, it all applies to all genders but I didn't include them coz it's not part of the topic, at least on that time. But there's something that I never said, which is I wanna avoid those people. I really didn't say it so I dunno where you got that. I honestly never avoid LGBT people. I just find some awkwardness being around them but that's just it and I stated the probable reason behind it. Anyways, I was also sharing my opinion and opening up so that people could look into how guys view LGBTs. I wasn't really ranting coz truthfully, I could also give the positive things that I find about LGBTs. As an average Joe, you could say that I represent a part of the guys who are a bit homophobic and these are probably there reasons too. I ain't gonna defend myself much more. And think of it, if I was really ranting, would I really postulate a probable solution to the problem in there? I mean about putting us homophobic guys around more LGBTs? Yeah, I gotta admit though that I was bit harsh on my wording. I really should've worded them better. For the third, I'm sorry about that. I'm not educated about this. So I'm really really sorry. I would not do it anymore next time. For the religion thingy, Ehrrmmm.... I have an argument against that but this is something that I do not want to talk about. I will offend people if I say something on this thingy. We rather leave the religion thingy now. For the latter part though, about the LGBT hate crimes, I pretty much lose that one coz I just based from my experience and from what I heard. Hmmm... about the hard to change stuff... I dunno. Well goes back to the experience thingy, rarely hear someone being thrown out by their family or being persecuted becoz they are LGBT, at least in my country. And yeah, I ain't anti-LGBT, I'm more leaning to pro-neutral. The deciding factor is the reasoning against and for it, and how it'll affect the society as a whole, like the family and the children, not just the appealing group of person. For the reasoning part, I tend to always look at the two sides of the coin not just at one side that feels right for me or at least, what most people says is the right one. I have looked up the reasoning that was put up by anti-LGBT activists, well most of it are moral ethics being violated, and I find those reasonable. There were also stuffs that are scientific like LGBT are against the nature of the law. But then I've heard some news that, they say that some animals can also be trans which I can't confirm. So I'm literally split there. Then there's the religion argument thingy that I just pretty much dismissed. As for the reasoning of the pro LGBT activists, no need to tell them really. About how it'll affect the society as a whole, I will just keep them to myself. Honestly, I really didn't want to go in this issue coz I am much uneducated about the history of LGBT, the root cause behind it, persecutions of LGBT and etc. etc. It's not that I do not care. It's just that, as I said a million times, my country doesn't have much problems with these coz it's not really a main issue here. We aren't given proper education on this. So all that I put out about LGBT have no concrete researching behind except for my argument against the religion being the big contributor on anti-LGBT (and you can include other problems). All of it are just my views and how I feel towards LGBT. This. I feel like that these stuffs are never taught. What's new? Religion always gets the blame anyways when it comes to things. (in reference to bold part) I haven't heard of there being trans animals (do animals even have a concept of gender identity...? who even knows) But homosexual behavior (I hate how that sounds but don't know how else to word it) has been seen in numerous species (x) I admittedly don't have much to add to this either and +1 to what Balthazar said 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hopes 237 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 Quote I disagree. The war in Iraq was more over Saddam's oil than anything else. WWII has been fought over many reasons, but Hitler's craziness didn't include religion, but mostly racial prejudices and banal thirst for power. The Soviet Union attacked Afghanistan, and USSR was a purely atheistic state. I apologize for my phrasing, I will correct it to "many wars". I was more referencing wars in the past, rather than modern warfare, that is my mistake! However, I am a bit confused in regards to the mention of WWII and Hitler though, because it most certainly did include religion, particularly in regards to the persecution of million of Jewish people. I do honestly believe, in my personal opinion, that religion is a cause for many conflicts. It stems from people's beliefs, and those contradict each other constantly. But just because it is a cause does not mean it's the only cause; I am by no means accusing religion for being the thing that caused all of the world's problems!! I would just like to highlight that religion is most definitely a big part in this issue, we cannot ignore that. And in response to MK -- if you feel uneducated, you always have the choice to educate yourself. No one is preventing you! I apologize again for the assumption of avoiding them, but typically you want to avoid something that irritates you, yes? I disagree with a few of your phrasings and the reasoning behind it, such as "average Joe" -- how can anyone be "average" in such a diverse society of race, gender, religion, orientation, socioeconomic status, and disabilities? But again, this is my personal view on the subject. ^^ Thank you for sharing your opinion, dude!! I greatly appreciate it, and I would like to remind everyone who is reading this topic that this is about tolerance and acceptance, not necessarily debating being for LGBTQA+ or being against it. This is a sensitive topic that affects many people, and we are not trying to start an argument or cause aggression; this is a safe space to know there are people supporting you if this issue directly affects you as it does my life. Please keep in mind the core reason this thread was created!! Edit: also thank you machine!!!! Your points are very accurate and I am grateful for your elaboration on the subject. *high five for aces!!* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IdentityUnknown 216 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 Wow uh... This has been an interesting conversation. And I think it's good that it's happened. I'll just toss my two cents in and be on my way. Personally, I'd like to take a moment to apologize for any insensitive comments I've ever made about the LGBTQA+ community. I know I have in the past. Those can be forgiven due to my lack of education on the matter during that time, but still. It really all comes down to educating yourself. Though it's getting better, a lot of people have been raised with stereotypes and generalities that do not apply to everyone. I identify as...well, I'm not entirely sure. Demisexual, maybe. Maybe grey-ace. Somewhere along those lines. Who even knows. I don't particularly enjoy labeling myself very specifically. I think places like the U.S. are gradually becoming more accepting towards members of the LGBTQA+ community, which is nice to see. I think I take the stance of "be yourself as long as you're not hurting anyone in the process." Including yourself. Some stuff on religion, since I do think it's relevant though it's also a point people argue a lot on... Reveal hidden contents It's weird for me because my family is fairly religious and I've struggled to reconcile that with what I believe. I've talked to both of my parents about the issue before, particularly my dad. I won't say what he says here since some of it, tbh, is pretty rude and homophobic. I personally don't believe that the Bible goes against LGBTQA. There's a lot of context involved in it and in the New Testament, the passage (Leviticus 20:13) people reference in arguments (largely in terms of homosexuality), a lot of rules are negated. People tend to pick and choose what they read from the Bible. I'd like to reference this post from Tumblr. As a disclaimer...I am taking these people at their word since I haven't fact checked this extensively. But honestly, regardless of how you take homosexuality in the Old Testament, I'd just say that Jesus says "do to others what you want them to do to you." (Matthew 7:12) And that, I'm pretty sure, is acceptance of who they are. Because it is a part of who you are and it is so very important. To be denied who you are is a terrible feeling that I don't believe anyone would wish upon themselves. The whole golden rule, love your neighbor like you would love yourself, etc. etc... Even if you morally disagree with LGBTQA because of your religion, it's important to learn to accept it. Love them and treat them equally. You might be uncomfortable because you're not used to it, because you haven't been raised to believe in it...but these people do and the least you can do is respect that. They're not harming you by loving one another. (Also there is definitely evidence of homosexual intercourse amongst animals and there are hermaphroditic animals out there...) Yeah that's mostly what I've got to say. It's important to develop an environment that is safe for those who identify as LGBTQA+. It's not just a recent issue; it's been around for years and years and is only just now coming to light. In a perfect world, we would just accept each other and move along. But that's not the world we live in and it is a big issue and we need to start addressing it as a problem so we can work towards solving it and making sure that a lot of the terrible tragedies that have happened don't happen again. That's primarily rooted in education. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Metantei Kiddo 147 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 On 2/24/2015 at 2:35 AM, Akakata said: I apologize for my phrasing, I will correct it to "many wars". I was more referencing wars in the past, rather than modern warfare, that is my mistake! However, I am a bit confused in regards to the mention of WWII and Hitler though, because it most certainly did include religion, particularly in regards to the persecution of million of Jewish people. I do honestly believe, in my personal opinion, that religion is a cause for many conflicts. It stems from people's beliefs, and those contradict each other constantly. But just because it is a cause does not mean it's the only cause; I am by no means accusing religion for being the thing that caused all of the world's problems!! I would just like to highlight that religion is most definitely a big part in this issue, we cannot ignore that. And in response to MK -- if you feel uneducated, you always have the choice to educate yourself. No one is preventing you! I apologize again for the assumption of avoiding them, but typically you want to avoid something that irritates you, yes? I disagree with a few of your phrasings and the reasoning behind it, such as "average Joe" -- how can anyone be "average" in such a diverse society of race, gender, religion, orientation, socioeconomic status, and disabilities? But again, this is my personal view on the subject. ^^ Thank you for sharing your opinion, dude!! I greatly appreciate it, and I would like to remind everyone who is reading this topic that this is about tolerance and acceptance, not necessarily debating being for LGBTQA+ or being against it. This is a sensitive topic that affects many people, and we are not trying to start an argument or cause aggression; this is a safe space to know there are people supporting you if this issue directly affects you as it does my life. Please keep in mind the core reason this thread was created!! Edit: also thank you machine!!!! Your points are very accurate and I am grateful for your elaboration on the subject. *high five for aces!!* Well... wasn't the one persecuted were the religious ones not the other way around? Plus, Hobogoblin was pretty much arguing on the 'cause' of the war, the nazis didn't go to war against world coz they hate the jewish people. I dunno what's his reasoning behind but it certainly isn't something correlated with the semitic people and their belief. And even if you say they were the reason, I would honestly call it a scapegoat than anything. I pretty much agree on the religion part contributing something to anti-LGBT-ism but it's contribution is not much bigger than any other reasons out there. Anyways, you just fallen to your own trap. You've stereotyped the religious people always arguing with each other or something. Honestly, humans, wholly, not just the religious ones can't always agree on anything, anyways. Example of these are astrophysicists who can't agree on how the universe began or if it was already there at the beginning. Or if dark matter exists or not. Then we could go on about the politics. This one for me, has caused more bloodshed compared to religion issues. Yeah, it stems from belief but not 'religious belief' but 'personal belief'. Well.. it's just that I don't like educating myself on stuffs that I deem not something that would be useful for me someday. IMO, it's just a bad use of time for me. I would of course will always gonna put first the stuffs that I am interested in learning than those that are mehhhh. Looking at my bucket list, educating myself on LGBTs is written on the last page. We already have a lot of LGBT advocators so I don't need to go in that place. I prefer to stay neutral in this topic and let just happen what needs to happen. Nah, my irritation towards them isn't a serious business, it's more of awkwardness than anything. Plus, mostly, when I'm irritated with something and I know that the cause of my irritation isn't morally right, I prefer to keep it to myself than anything. I try to suppress it as much as possible. Yup :3 On 2/24/2015 at 3:59 AM, IdentityUnknown said: Wow uh... This has been an interesting conversation. And I think it's good that it's happened. I'll just toss my two cents in and be on my way. Personally, I'd like to take a moment to apologize for any insensitive comments I've ever made about the LGBTQA+ community. I know I have in the past. Those can be forgiven due to my lack of education on the matter during that time, but still. It really all comes down to educating yourself. Though it's getting better, a lot of people have been raised with stereotypes and generalities that do not apply to everyone. I identify as...well, I'm not entirely sure. Demisexual, maybe. Maybe grey-ace. Somewhere along those lines. Who even knows. I don't particularly enjoy labeling myself very specifically. I think places like the U.S. are gradually becoming more accepting towards members of the LGBTQA+ community, which is nice to see. I think I take the stance of "be yourself as long as you're not hurting anyone in the process." Including yourself. Some stuff on religion, since I do think it's relevant though it's also a point people argue a lot on... Reveal hidden contents It's weird for me because my family is fairly religious and I've struggled to reconcile that with what I believe. I've talked to both of my parents about the issue before, particularly my dad. I won't say what he says here since some of it, tbh, is pretty rude and homophobic. I personally don't believe that the Bible goes against LGBTQA. There's a lot of context involved in it and in the New Testament, the passage (Leviticus 20:13) people reference in arguments (largely in terms of homosexuality), a lot of rules are negated. People tend to pick and choose what they read from the Bible. I'd like to reference this post from Tumblr. As a disclaimer...I am taking these people at their word since I haven't fact checked this extensively. But honestly, regardless of how you take homosexuality in the Old Testament, I'd just say that Jesus says "do to others what you want them to do to you." (Matthew 7:12) And that, I'm pretty sure, is acceptance of who they are. Because it is a part of who you are and it is so very important. To be denied who you are is a terrible feeling that I don't believe anyone would wish upon themselves. The whole golden rule, love your neighbor like you would love yourself, etc. etc... Even if you morally disagree with LGBTQA because of your religion, it's important to learn to accept it. Love them and treat them equally. You might be uncomfortable because you're not used to it, because you haven't been raised to believe in it...but these people do and the least you can do is respect that. They're not harming you by loving one another. (Also there is definitely evidence of homosexual intercourse amongst animals and there are hermaphroditic animals out there...) Yeah that's mostly what I've got to say. It's important to develop an environment that is safe for those who identify as LGBTQA+. It's not just a recent issue; it's been around for years and years and is only just now coming to light. In a perfect world, we would just accept each other and move along. But that's not the world we live in and it is a big issue and we need to start addressing it as a problem so we can work towards solving it and making sure that a lot of the terrible tragedies that have happened don't happen again. That's primarily rooted in education. Warning: Religious references. Reveal hidden contents The bible definitely isn't against LGBTs. Most advocators of the Anti-LGBTs who says that it is written in the bible are completely misunderstanding the book. They are taking things out of context. Most of the time, they are quoting the old laws that only applies to the old times in Israel. Honestly, you would follow the most recent law established by Jesus himself, coz it's "Christian"... duh. The Old Testament was meant to be a historical background of the religion than anything, IMO. What the Christians should follow is the law written in the New Testament which was summed up by Jesus in two golden rule, which is "Love and honor your God" and "Love your neighbors as you love yourself". He even said that you only need to follow this laws in Gospel of Luke and you are pretty much just gonna do fine. So if we assume that, every other laws written in the bible and everything that is advocated by the church that doesn't agree with the two golden rule are pretty much void and heretic. Going back to the topic, does maltreating the LGBTs go with the 2 golden rule? Sadly, no. Haha, I wanna rant about how it's the Church, especially the cult (Yes cult... I could give a thousand reasons. Click here!) invented by Constantine which is the Roman Catholic, fault why everything has turned so badly for Christianity. They were pretty much inventing their own laws that are unscriptural and doesn't abide with what Jesus taught. One of the laws are those that goes with Anti-LGBTs. @machine-Well I meant that not the concept of gender or something But definitely there is a gender role in most animals. Male and female, naturally, that is, if you're gonna base on reproduction and stuffs. Anyways, just to make my religion clear, I am not a Catholic nor do I abide to any religion. I'm pretty much a Deist who leans towards Buddhism and a bit towards Christianity. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Balthazar Manfredie 226 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 I have a question: How come folks who don't accept homosexuals and are against it are being labeled homophobes would have been nice if i got the +1, machine Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 On 2/24/2015 at 8:30 AM, Reverend Balthazar said: I have a question: How come folks who don't accept homosexuals and are against it are being labeled homophobes would have been nice if i got the +1, machine fixed, sorry orz I keep forgetting that's a thing here and not just shorthand Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hobgoblin2012 49 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 On 2/24/2015 at 2:35 AM, Akakata said: However, I am a bit confused in regards to the mention of WWII and Hitler though, because it most certainly did include religion, particularly in regards to the persecution of million of Jewish people. I may be wrong, but I always thought Hitler persecuted Jewish people because he thought of them as "an inferior race", not because of following a certain religion. I mean, if a person of ethnic Jewish origins was an atheist or a follower of a religion different from Judaism, they would have been repressed anyway. To be honest, the only reference to religion among nazis that I ever heard of is that the SS wore the "Gott mit uns" (God with us) writing on their belts. And I forgot to say yesterday: my whole sympathy and condolences to the suicide victims you were talking about. Even being religious, I disagree completely with those religious people who say that suicide is an "unforgivable sin". In my opinion, people who kill themselves have a very serious reason and almost always deserve more compassion than anybody else. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hopes 237 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 @MK I don't want to argue with you. I do not believe that my statement about religion is stereotyping; the statement that beliefs cause conflicts is a true one. People who believe different things are bound to have disagreements. And I never specified only religious beliefs, compared to personal beliefs -- which are also inherently connected. There was also never a "trap" set in the first place. @Balthazar Google "definition of homophobia" and you'll have your answer. The literal definition of the word is "dislike of or prejudice against homosexual people." @Hobgoblin Thanks for the clarification!! I get where you're coming from. And thank you very much for your kind words!I once again ask that we bring an end to any of the debates over this here. The thread is here solely to share support and acceptance, not to cause disharmony among the DCW community if some disagree with LGBTQA+. It is not to argue over whether or not it should be legal; I was hoping this would be more for updates on the subject and for people being able to share their personal experiences as a member of the LGBTQA+ community. Allies are certainly welcome, but again: this is not here to argue about. I am not trying to make this thread exclusive or anything like that, I only want to restrict the debating as much as possible because that isn't what this thread is for. I hope everyone understands what the purpose of this thread is. Please, please keep this in mind. Thank you!! Quote I identify as...well, I'm not entirely sure. Demisexual, maybe. Maybe grey-ace. Somewhere along those lines. Who even knows. I don't particularly enjoy labeling myself very specifically. As mentioned earlier, I identify as akiobisexual demiromantic, so I am gray ace and gray aro!! I like having a label myself, but I know many -- like Jean -- also don't like having one too! My boyfriend is transgender as well as queer. Many of my friends are also part of this community, so it is very important to me!! @machine I apologize for not responding to your previous post about your gender identity and orientations. Those are great, and I'll definitely make sure to use those pronouns for you!! I agree wholeheartedly with your statement of gender expression =/= gender identity. I really wish this was more understood by others, and I wish it was more common for people to use they/them pronouns if the person's gender is unclear before assuming female or male just by the way they look. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Balthazar Manfredie 226 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 On 2/24/2015 at 4:58 PM, Akakata said: @Balthazar Google "definition of homophobia" and you'll have your answer. The literal definition of the word is "dislike of or prejudice against homosexual people." but why is there a word phobia attached to the word homo english is not my language so this is for research purpose Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hopes 237 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 Oh!! Phobia is a fear of something. For example, arachnophobia is fear of spiders!! It all depends on the prefix too. A "homophobe" is a person who has homophobia. Does that make sense? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 On 2/24/2015 at 9:39 PM, Akakata said: Oh!! Phobia is a fear of something. For example, arachnophobia is fear of spiders!! It all depends on the prefix too. A "homophobe" is a person who has homophobia. Does that make sense? I'd like to add that the suffix -phobia also means hatred and along with fear. When you google "define -phobia" the second definition is what applies to homophobia and transphobia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Balthazar Manfredie 226 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 Wait. So phobia also means hate. Is this what you guys mean. I knew phobia was fear, but why is it used in this way. But how can fear and hate be that related. I hate a lot of things but dont fear them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted February 24, 2015 On 2/24/2015 at 11:30 PM, Reverend Balthazar said: Wait. So phobia also means hate. Is this what you guys mean. I knew phobia was fear, but why is it used in this way. But how can fear and hate be that related. I hate a lot of things but dont fear them. Yep. It's just another instance of English being weird. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Balthazar Manfredie 226 Report post Posted February 25, 2015 Then how about this I know a guy, he is against this but at the same time he is not a homophobe, goes to college with some, works and studies with some just recently was hit on by, even high fives some while playing sports Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maltavite 61 Report post Posted February 25, 2015 On 2/24/2015 at 2:35 AM, Akakata said: I do honestly believe, in my personal opinion, that religion is a cause for many conflicts. It stems from people's beliefs, and those contradict each other constantly. But just because it is a cause does not mean it's the only cause; I am by no means accusing religion for being the thing that caused all of the world's problems!! I would just like to highlight that religion is most definitely a big part in this issue, we cannot ignore that. Personally, not all conflict was caused by religion. But some people decided to bring religion into it. I hate any religious people who is narrow minded, or any people who mix religion with politics. BTW as for LGBTQA, they can achieve a better life. I think religious people hate the LGBT because they can live better than the religious people. I'm personally accepts anyone, regardless of their gender, religion, or nationality as long as they have morals. - Ari (Old man Daletski) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted February 25, 2015 On 2/25/2015 at 7:40 AM, Reverend Balthazar said: Then how about this I know a guy, he is against this but at the same time he is not a homophobe, goes to college with some, works and studies with some just recently was hit on by, even high fives some while playing sports By "against this" you're referring to gay marriage right? There's varying levels of homophobia. Ranging from finding LGBTQIA+ people disgusting and/or freaks, being against gay marriage, gay and trans panic, wanting to hurt queer people, parents kicking out/abusing their queer children, making rude comments/using slurs, saying LGBTQIA+ stuff is sinful, and the whole "I don't have a problem with it but can you and your same gender partner please refrain from showing any signs of affection in front of my kids" thing. Obviously some are more serious than others but they're all still problems and things we should strive to fix in the future Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Balthazar Manfredie 226 Report post Posted February 25, 2015 On 2/25/2015 at 5:19 PM, machine said: By "against this" you're referring to gay marriage right? There's varying levels of homophobia. Ranging from finding LGBTQIA+ people disgusting and/or freaks, being against gay marriage, gay and trans panic, wanting to hurt queer people, parents kicking out/abusing their queer children, making rude comments/using slurs, saying LGBTQIA+ stuff is sinful, and the whole "I don't have a problem with it but can you and your same gender partner please refrain from showing any signs of affection in front of my kids" thing. Obviously some are more serious than others but they're all still problems and things we should strive to fix in the future you have answered it all Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted February 26, 2015 so I read through the previous pages of the thread and I must say I really like how the conversation's progressed from what it used to be to where it is now On 2/24/2015 at 4:58 PM, Akakata said: @machine I apologize for not responding to your previous post about your gender identity and orientations. Those are great, and I'll definitely make sure to use those pronouns for you!! I agree wholeheartedly with your statement of gender expression =/= gender identity. I really wish this was more understood by others, and I wish it was more common for people to use they/them pronouns if the person's gender is unclear before assuming female or male just by the way they look. It's ok! And thank you btw! c: Yeah it is a little frustrating that majority of the world only sees male and female, hopefully that'll change soon though! I think all the awareness for trans and genderqueer people that is going on currently is really helping even if it's only talked about on a handful of non-LGBTGIA+ centered websites. It's far from being a commonly understood thing but it's a good start at the very least! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kirsch 95 Report post Posted March 5, 2015 (edited) www.youtube.com/watch?v=PD-INsIbVcw Also, I find the recent tabloid "news" around Bruce Jenner (what's her new name?) to be interesting. For her, a multi-millionaire, high-profile reality star to come out like that is... Wow. Edited March 5, 2015 by Kirsch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Akazora 293 Report post Posted March 5, 2015 On 3/5/2015 at 1:24 AM, Kirsch said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PD-INsIbVcw Also, I find the recent tabloid "news" around Bruce Jenner to be interesting. For him, a multi-millionaire, high-profile reality star to come out like that is... Wow. FTFY Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted March 5, 2015 dammit alabama On 3/5/2015 at 1:24 AM, Kirsch said: Reveal hidden contents https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PD-INsIbVcw Also, I find the recent tabloid "news" around Bruce Jenner to be interesting. For him, a multi-millionaire, high-profile reality star to come out like that is... Wow. I heard about that. I feel really bad that she's being misgendered everywhere and kinda having some personal questions thrown at her about her transition as that's a personal thing y'know? Though I don't particularly like the way it's being handled, it's nice to see someone with a very high amount of celebrity status come out as trans. Another celebrity came out as trans a little while ago too. Angel Haze, a rapper if I'm not mistaken, came out as agender not too long ago on twitter. Non-binary genders aren't as often talked about so this was pretty cool too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kirsch 95 Report post Posted March 5, 2015 On 3/5/2015 at 7:22 AM, machine said: dammit alabama I heard about that. I feel really bad that she's being misgendered everywhere and kinda having some personal questions thrown at her about her transition as that's a personal thing y'know? Though I don't particularly like the way it's being handled, it's nice to see someone with a very high amount of celebrity status come out as trans. Another celebrity came out as trans a little while ago too. Angel Haze, a rapper if I'm not mistaken, came out as agender not too long ago on twitter. Non-binary genders aren't as often talked about so this was pretty cool too. and it was going so well. Didn't even know they can revoke the marriage licenses Oh crap, sorry for the wrong pronoun. I'm so used to the he/him .-. And yeah, it's depressing to think about how she's got tabloids on her. I don't really get agender. I know trans have gender dysphoria, and that's often the way they manage to identify themselves, but if you're agender... That must be really hard to figure out, isn't it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machine 52 Report post Posted March 6, 2015 On 3/5/2015 at 5:06 PM, Kirsch said: and it was going so well. Didn't even know they can revoke the marriage licenses Oh crap, sorry for the wrong pronoun. I'm so used to the he/him .-. And yeah, it's depressing to think about how she's got tabloids on her. I don't really get agender. I know trans have gender dysphoria, and that's often the way they manage to identify themselves, but if you're agender... That must be really hard to figure out, isn't it? I didn't either I just feel horrible for all the same sex couples that started planning their weddings/got engaged during the short amount of time it was legal only to have it go back to being illegal a couple days later And I can try to explain how agender people might feel (I'll be partly speaking from firsthand experience on this. As everyone goes through different things this obviously won't be a clean cut, widely agreed upon response of what it means to be agender. I also kept in mind on what I've heard other agender people say about their identities) To make things simple and hopefully less confusing let's limit the gender spectrum down to male, female, androgynous, and agender. Male and female are on the very extreme ends of the spectrum, androgyny's in the middle, and agender's off somewhere else. Agender's neither male nor female (nor a combination of the two). For some it might just mean they don't care much about their gender, they see themselves as themselves instead of a gender. (these folk also tend to not care about gender roles much at all) For others, them being agender is important to them and makes up a huge part of them. (I've noticed these people usually are more.. aware of gender roles I guess and usually go out of their to try to appear especially neither male nor female) In my case, I realized I was agender when I had the thought that I didn't want to be nor always be seen as male and/or female, I want to be considered a person first and foremost rather than a gender if that makes sense. (I kinda have to word that weirdly since I also ID as androgynous and that can sound contradictory saying I feel like a combination of a both yet neither at the same time. I don't fully get it either at times.) sorry if you weren't particularly looking for an answer to that btw... and I'm really tired so I apologize for any typos as well EDIT: so this happened! I liked the way the newscasters and Planet Fitness handled the whole thing. As for the people they interviewed, I can't say their responses were exactly surprising but it really shows just how little the general public knows about transgender individuals as a whole. The woman who got her Planet Fitness membership revoked annoyed me a lot though. At the very least, it's nice to see that this is a story about a transphobic person (notice how she continues to use "he" after learning the "man" in the locker room is actually a woman) getting kicked out of an accepting place instead of the transwoman being kicked out for making people uncomfortable. EDIT 2: I found an LGBTQIA+ social networking site through an asexuality group I'm in on facebook. It's called Skittlr. I've just joined it myself and am admittedly still a little hesitant of it. The layout's reminiscent of facebook, especially the chat feature. It seems kinda cool???? The general chat and few groups I've joined seem friendly enough. I just thought I'd mention it. and if anyone cares I'm machine on there as well Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
