Ran finding out Conan is Shinichi?

[Chekhov MacGuffin 1089]

For the first part... No, I'm referring to the Bourbon that has access to EVERYTHING, including the files of the declared dead, and after finding that Sherry declared Kudou dead, investigated and found there was no death certificate and no burial of him.

But Bourbon isn't interested in Shinichi. He wants Akai and maybe Sherry. To have the motivation to get the files about Shinichi in the first place, he would have to connect Conan and Shinichi, which if he is scar Akai, hasn't come anywhere close to happening.

And connected the dots to the likely conclusion that the little boy who appeared shortly after and started living with Kudo's childhood friend is in actuality Kudo, since it was known that the drug had the slim possibility of shrinking.

Sherry did not report the results that several of her mice shrank to the greater organization because they have not been able to figure out how Shiho managed to escape the locked room. If Shiho had reported her data, the Organization would have known that shrinking was a possible side effect of APTX 4869 and would have figured out how she escaped and begun looking for a child. Furthermore, if Shiho had reported to the Organization that APTX 4869 had the possibility of leaving the victim alive, the Boss and/or Shiho's superiors would not have permitted the drug in situations where the victim, if surviving, could escape as in Shinichi's case or the time sensitive assassination of Nomiguchi Shigehiko.

Remember, in the appearance of Ai, she cited that it is likely that they would investigate everything that she did, because she is now seen as a traitor. If he is as good of a detective as Gosho is making him out to be, that line of reasoning shouldn't be too hard to come to.

They still seem to regard Shinichi as dead.

As for the latter argument, yes, Vermouth was usually there, but that does not mean that someone else noticed. We do not know if there were other BO members on stand-by, even Ai suggested that as a possibility. Like any good operation, there is always a possibility that there are other members, and communication lines. So if something seemed off they could have contacted other members.

Prove they exist. It's a possibility, but there is no evidence of additional members hanging around who saw Conan. If we roll through the cases, the Akemi case doesn't matter because Conan was in the newspaper. There wouldn't be any in the bullet train case because they were aiming to blow the train up. Tequila's was probably a one person exchange because the prior exchanges (first case and Shinkansen) only involved Gin and Vodka who were together without additional help. For the mourning party, it was only mentioned that they had to drag Vermouth in to help; Gin didn't mention others. If there were others, they would have helped Pisco. Besides Vermouth, Pisco seemed to be on his own. The bus jack was a Vermouth only affair because she working in secret. There were none in the case part of the Itakura case because they would have reported Itakura's murder. The locker half of the Itakura case there were assistants to Vodka who reported a kid, but no further details and that detail was promptly was ignored afterwards when Gin discounted a kid being involved by stopping his locker search. Vermouth did bring Calvados, but no one else to the Shipyard showdown because she was acting outside of orders and had to use unconventional means (using his infatuation) to get Calvados there in the first place. In FBI and the Org, only Kir and Vermouth saw Conan for the first part. Any additional BO members hanging around would have noticed the shooting and alerted someone about Jodie. The second half of FBI vs. the Org, they saw Conan so I am ignoring that. In Clash, Rikumichi acted alone to take secret pictures and such, if he had a second person, they would have been watching his back and he would have had a heads up to the FBI surrounding him in the nurse's station. That person would have also alerted the BO directly about the loss of Rikumichi; Vodka said he lost touch with the guy, not got a report Rikumichi was discovered. Vodka did say he sent in a second guy, and we heard about FBI, but no suspicious kids. A lack of communication here means that Conan's presence was not announced to the parties who would need to know (Gin and Vodka.) And finally, scar Akai has seen Conan only in not directly BO related cases, so I'm not counting him.

For instance Gin and Vodka were there too, since Gin killed Pisco (as far as I can recall) and nearly killed Shiho Miyano. How do we know that they didn't see the boy that lives at the Mouri Detective Agency. Just because Conan did not see them, does not mean that they did not see him.

If you follow Conan's path, it's unlikely they would have crossed unintentionally. Conan was in the car at their arrival and stayed in the car up until the time they went to the old buildings's wine storage room. Conan then went to the main front desk and found out the wine storage in in the old building which implies the front desk is not in the old building or they would have said "this building". Meanwhile the BO went to the roof of the old building; presumably they don't have to go back to the new building's front desk to get to the roof of the old building, so they wouldn't have encountered Conan at this time. They got to the roof ahead of Conan so it's unlikely they crossed here. Conan then went to the roof where the BO didn't see him because he hid behind the door, then left to go back to wine storage room via the stairs behind him. Gin went down the chimney to shoot Pisco. Presumably Vodka stayed behind to help Gin out or left altogether to get clear of incoming firemen. He obviously didn't see Conan. Conan had already grabbed Haibara and retreated before Gin got down the chimney: flames were obscuring the far door at any rate. Gin went back up the chimney and Conan got Haibara to the car; I assume he wouldn't be so foolish as to load Haibara in right in front of the Porsche if anyone was in it.

[Kyuu Nye 425]

But Bourbon isn't interested in Shinichi. He wants Akai and maybe Sherry. To have the motivation to get the files about Shinichi in the first place, he would have to connect Conan and Shinichi, which if he is scar Akai, hasn't come anywhere close to happening.

Sherry did not report the results that several of her mice shrank to the greater organization because they have not been able to figure out how Shiho managed to escape the locked room. If Shiho had reported her data, the Organization would have known that shrinking was a possible side effect of APTX 4869 and would have figured out how she escaped and begun looking for a child. Furthermore, if Shiho had reported to the Organization that APTX 4869 had the possibility of leaving the victim alive, the Boss and/or Shiho's superiors would not have permitted the drug in situations where the victim, if surviving, could escape as in Shinichi's case or the time sensitive assassination of Nomiguchi Shigehiko.

They still seem to regard Shinichi as dead.

Prove they exist. It's a possibility, but there is no evidence of additional members hanging around who saw Conan. If we roll through the cases, the Akemi case doesn't matter because Conan was in the newspaper. There wouldn't be any in the bullet train case because they were aiming to blow the train up. Tequila's was probably a one person exchange because the prior exchanges (first case and Shinkansen) only involved Gin and Vodka who were together without additional help. For the mourning party, it was only mentioned that they had to drag Vermouth to help; Gin didn't mention others. If there were others, they would help Pisco. Besides Vermouth, Pisco seemed to be on his own. The bus jack was a Vermouth only affair because she working in secret. There were none in the case part of the Itakura case because they would have reported Itakura's murder. The locker half of the Itakura case there were assistants to Vodka who reported a kid, but no further details and that detail was promptly was ignored afterwards when Gin discounted a kid being involved by stopping his locker search. Vermouth did bring Calvados, but no one else to the Shipyard showdown because she was acting outside of orders and had to use unconventional means (using his infatuation) to get Calvados there in the first place. In FBI and the Org, only Kir and Vermouth saw Conan for the first part. Any additional BO members hanging around would have noticed the shooting and alerted someone about Jodie. The second half of FBI vs. the Org, they saw Conan so I am ignoring that. In Clash, Rikumichi acted alone to take secret pictures and such, if he had a second person, they would have been watching his back and he would have had a heads up to the FBI surrounding him in the nurse's station. That person would have also alerted the BO directly about the loss of Rikumichi; Vodka said he lost touch with the guy, not got a report Rikumichi was discovered. Vodka did say he sent in a second guy, and we heard about FBI, but no suspicious kids. A lack of communication here means that Conan's presence was not announced to the parties who would need to know (Gin and Vodka.) And finally, scar Akai has seen Conan only in not directly BO related cases, so I'm not counting him.

If you follow Conan's path, it's unlikely they would have crossed unintentionally. Conan was in the car at their arrival and stayed in the car up until the time they went to the old buildings's wine storage room. Conan then went to the main front desk and found out the wine storage in in the old building which implies the front desk is not in the old building or they would have said "this building". Meanwhile the BO went to the roof of the old building; presumably they don't have to go back to the new building's front desk to get to the roof of the old building, so they wouldn't have encountered Conan at this time. They got to the roof ahead of Conan so it's unlikely they crossed here. Conan then went to the roof where the BO didn't see him because he hid behind the door, then left to go back to wine storage room via the stairs behind him. Gin went down the chimney to shoot Pisco. Presumably Vodka stayed behind to help Gin out or left altogether to get clear of incoming firemen. He obviously didn't see Conan. Conan had already grabbed Haibara and retreated before Gin got down the chimney: flames were obscuring the far door at any rate. Gin went back up the chimney and Conan got Haibara to the car; I assume he wouldn't be so foolish as to load Haibara in right in front of the Porsche if anyone was in it.

Your argument for the second half is extremely solid. There is no evidence of support teams, but the possibility remains. However, since there is no proof of that, I cannot use it to form a solid argument. And must concede that point.

We don't fully know where Bourbon's interests lie. We know he is on the team to find Sherry. Now assuming that he is as smart as they are claiming, he would have first started to learn about her which includes looking through her research data. This means that Bourbon would have known about the drug's shrinking capability. In science all observances are recorded, and I'm sure other scientists knew it too. However, because of the fact that they used it on likely hundreds of mice, and only one shrank, they passed it onto field testing. Considering the extreme unlikelihood that it would have shrunk anyone they probably didn't consider it and wrote that off as an anomaly. However, Bourbon is extremely likely to have made that connection. I'm not entirely convinced who Bourbon is, or if he has even been introduced. Gosho seems intent on making Okiya seem as suspicious as possible (which I admit adds to your theory of him being NOT Bourbon, because Gosho just loves doing that, setting up false pretenses), so I agree that that is not the case. It is entirely possible that Bourbon is Scar Akai since Bourbon said Scar Akai is not Akai. The possibility remains that we have never seen him. Getting back to the main point as I have deviated slightly. If we assume that he is after Sherry, he likely investigated her and discovered these things as I stated. If he found out about Kudou he could have very well used that as a point to start investigating and found Haibara, and thus already knows, or at least has a very good idea. He probably has insufficient evidence to support his claims and thus hasn't acted on it. Because if the BO has done as much testing the mere possibility of shrinking is not enough because only one mouse was affected by the strange side effect, the mere fact that two people in such a short period of time and slim control number would have to be proven, and I'm not sure a likeness would be enough, especially since Gin confronted the adult Sherry at the party.

(edit: btw, I've become very lazy, so I have lost my drive to make extremely lengthy replies like I used to )

[ZaydenRei 1]

I don't really think it shoud be the last episode(though that could happen). As many've seen it is hard on both of them, one not being able to tell and the other not knowing the truth (that's part of the drama/comedy I know).

If Ran did find out would she be alone ? (obviously sonoko is a bit of a gossip, and her dad is just a coward sometimes) How would be the best way to do it? Sometimes it seems like she knows, but when conan would get into terrible trouble she writes it off/acts like she doesn't.

Note: I think Ran and her mom have an idea about who Conan could be, and if her dad was a better detective he would already know.. he's been hit with enough darts to figure it out (lol). I would like to see either Ran turned into a child (sonoko is iffy) or Kudo changed back into a teenager. Ai-chan seems to have found a man in one of the 2 male detective boys, plus it's a full time job almost keeping the professor healthy.

[nanaironokaze 7]

having a shinran moment as the end is probably the most fitting. How else would a ROMANCE DETECTIVE COMEDY end? It would be the way to tie all the extra loose ends together(ran's side of the story covers her parents, conan's covering agasa, ai and the detective boys...) the author is clearly going for shinran, so having a moment at the very end would end things off nicely

[ZaydenRei 1]

I have been enjoying the combined plot so far (movie, series, etc.),but if they end it like that are they teens, kids or the way they are now(episode 634)? so many quesitons... but that doesn't mean the end isn't near. There have been shows/movies/etc that have ended leaving a load of questions (like it was all good)...*sigh*

Awesomeness

[nanaironokaze 7]

though there are many strange circumstances, the author will probably clear them all up. he doesn't seem to want to leave a lot of loose ends. why else would he make permanent pairings for somewhat irrelevant characters?(shiratori, chiba, etc) also, because it is fictional, DC could just have a time gap that shows the highschoolers as adults, so what age they are now doesn't really prove a problem, romance-wise. lastly, aoyama will surely find the antidote. that's why ova 9 exists, ne~ :-D ?

[ZaydenRei 1]

yeah the nightmare conan has in OVA 9 is like one of the worst things that could happen for him and ran tho.. it seemed she knew but couldn't/wouldn't act on it. sad... it's one of the things that made me want Ran to get turned/revert back into a kid conan's age if ai-chan couldn't find a perminant antidote for kudo. I realize it would be best if she was turned back into a kid for the B.O to be no more OR leave them alone.

Vermoth needs a man to ;-).. maybe a dr

[DetectiveR-2011 1]

I personally do not want Detective Conan to end... I hope they keep it ongoing...

[Antiyonder 10]

My stance on the necessity of keeping Ran in the dark is that it's weakened. To start, there's a fanfic writer who summed it up the best in his story

"Agasa, Ai, Shinichi, and Heiji all seem to think that if Ran finds out the secret then it would only be a matter of time before the Black Organization tracked them down and slaughtered them all. This would seem to imply that this would result because of Ran. How insulting is that? I can understand if they feel that Ran is not good at lying just as I understand why Holmes deceives Watson from time to time, but that doesn't mean I can't feel peeved on behalf of the characters being deceived."

To back his and my stance up, I could see the importance of keeping Ran out of the loop when Agasa was the only person involved. But now, the insinuation is "Heiji, Haibara, my parents, Vermouth and Eisuke know who I am, but if Ran finds out, then we're all done for". Haibara mind you is in the same situation, and thus she couldn't be fooled into thinking that Conan and Shinichi are different people. But counting her and Agasa, 7 people discovered his secret, and the feared scenario hasn't happened yet. And well, if more characters find out, it only serves to make keeping her in the dark pointless.

[Kaitou Kid Legendary Thief 197]

My stance on the necessity of keeping Ran in the dark is that it's weakened. To start, there's a fanfic writer who summed it up the best in his story

"Agasa, Ai, Shinichi, and Heiji all seem to think that if Ran finds out the secret then it would only be a matter of time before the Black Organization tracked them down and slaughtered them all. This would seem to imply that this would result because of Ran. How insulting is that? I can understand if they feel that Ran is not good at lying just as I understand why Holmes deceives Watson from time to time, but that doesn't mean I can't feel peeved on behalf of the characters being deceived."

To back his and my stance up, I could see the importance of keeping Ran out of the loop when Agasa was the only person involved. But now, the insinuation is "Heiji, Haibara, my parents, Vermouth and Eisuke know who I am, but if Ran finds out, then we're all done for". Haibara mind you is in the same situation, and thus she couldn't be fooled into thinking that Conan and Shinichi are different people. But counting her and Agasa, 7 people discovered his secret, and the feared scenario hasn't happened yet. And well, if more characters find out, it only serves to make keeping her in the dark pointless.

I don't think that is the exact reason why she was kept in the dark.

According to Agasa's explanation, Ran would have difficulty in trying to keep it as a secret unlike the rest. Heiji and His parents are highly intelligent and capable of getting themselves out of weird situations. Vermouth and Eisuke cannot be helped... they found it out themselves instead of being told. I believe the exact reason for not letting Ran know was because, it would mean letting her into the chase for the Black Organization. If anyone thinks that telling her about the situation and asking her to stay away and not be worried is actually possible, then I have nothing to say...

Think about it... What would happen if Ran (who loves Shinichi) knows that Shinichi is actually Conan?

It would be awfully weird and suspicious if Ran started hanging around Conan very often or look lovingly at at a 7 year old boy and blushing and stuff... She would start feeling awkward around him and this is a potential danger. When the BO suspects something, she will be the first to be targeted since she is the most vulnerable. And with little investigation, everyone will find out that Conan is Shinichi. Furthermore, if the BO suspects that she knows something, she will be in grave danger - the main reason why she shouldn't know anything about it, and why Shinichi struggled not to tell her.

[Antiyonder 10]

I don't think that is the exact reason why she was kept in the dark.

According to Agasa's explanation, Ran would have difficulty in trying to keep it as a secret unlike the rest. Heiji and His parents are highly intelligent and capable of getting themselves out of weird situations. Vermouth and Eisuke cannot be helped... they found it out themselves instead of being told. I believe the exact reason for not letting Ran know was because, it would mean letting her into the chase for the Black Organization. If anyone thinks that telling her about the situation and asking her to stay away and not be worried is actually possible, then I have nothing to say...

Think about it... What would happen if Ran (who loves Shinichi) knows that Shinichi is actually Conan?

It would be awfully weird and suspicious if Ran started hanging around Conan very often or look lovingly at at a 7 year old boy and blushing and stuff... She would start feeling awkward around him and this is a potential danger. When the BO suspects something, she will be the first to be targeted since she is the most vulnerable. And with little investigation, everyone will find out that Conan is Shinichi. Furthermore, if the BO suspects that she knows something, she will be in grave danger - the main reason why she shouldn't know anything about it, and why Shinichi struggled not to tell her.

Sure, but that's precisely the point I was looking to make in my previous post. "If we tell Ran, then we are definitely doomed". I mean if she's known for being lousy at lying or keeping a secret (not counting any anime exclusive stories), then sure, telling her would be suicide.

Now that I think about it, hasn't Ran been doing well at keeping quiet about Shinichi in front of Okiya?

[Kaitou Kid Legendary Thief 197]

Sure, but that's precisely the point I was looking to make in my previous post. "If we tell Ran, then we are definitely doomed". I mean if she's known for being lousy at lying or keeping a secret (not counting any anime exclusive stories), then sure, telling her would be suicide.

Now that I think about it, hasn't Ran been doing well at keeping quiet about Shinichi in front of Okiya?

Yes, that's right. Definitely might be too extreme, but quite true, they will be a lot more prone to being discovered if she knew. I was just trying to say that I believe the main reason that Shinichi wouldn't let Ran know was not only that. Perhaps that is only 50% of the reason. If ever, his identity was being found out and chased by the BO one day, I believe he would still not tell Ran about it. He wouldn't want to endanger her life at any cost.

And I agree she can be pretty good at keeping quiet~ And keeping her mouth shut about secrets for that matter~ However, I think she's a person who is pretty easy to read. Not saying anything about something doesn't mean the other party wouldn't know about anything. I think, Okiya might already be suspecting something's wrong with the house... But he might not have linked his suspicions to Conan because he still knows nothing. If Ran continues to stay quiet, even if she was acting suspiciously, his suspicions wouldn't deal any damage.

[Sayomi 17]

I personally do not want Detective Conan to end... I hope they keep it ongoing...

Well, Gosho isn't immortal so it has to end sometime

[ZaydenRei 1]

all i'm asking for is an understandable ending

[tengaku squared 291]

I always have a different opinion when someone asks questions like these. :V

My answer: "I hope she doesn't find out. It's best."

[Antiyonder 10]

Granted they don't need to have her find out right away (presuming that Gosho does intend for a confession to take place), but it should at least be a little sooner than the big confrontation with the Organization. For a couple reasons:

1. Having her find out at the end means that she instantly forgives him for the deception. Revealing it sooner prevents that.

2. Maybe it's a weak reason, but it would make for an interesting change of pace to have her helping out from time to time (whether it's with a case or helping to maintain the secret)

I always have a different opinion when someone asks questions like these. :V

My answer: "I hope she doesn't find out. It's best."

If you don't mind me asking, how come?

[ZaydenRei 1]

if ran finds out..what about sonoko?

they do have posters where Ran is using the bowtie device

Episodes where I think she knows that conan is Kudo: The clay/pottery killing and those like that, where she makes sure conan sees the message to Kudo.. but the next episode it's like she doesn't know. ???

[yungching 24]

I personally do not want Detective Conan to end... I hope they keep it ongoing...

I don't want it to end either, but I think it would be better if it ended, because I do want to see Conan defeating the BO... Unless the series could keep continuing after that. Anyway, I think that Conan should tell Ran at some point, because when he turns back into Shinichi (if he does) it would be too obvious that Conan disappears right at the same time.

[ZaydenRei 1]

I don't want it to end either, but I think it would be better if it ended, because I do want to see Conan defeating the BO... Unless the series could keep continuing after that. Anyway, I think that Conan should tell Ran at some point, because when he turns back into Shinichi (if he does) it would be too obvious that Conan disappears right at the same time.

u have a point

[yungching 24]

I just thought of a way Shinichi could tell Ran without revealing to her that he is actually Conan. Note: this will only work if Conan turns back into Shinichi and the BO is defeated. He could tell Ran that he was looking for the BO, and that Conan's parents were helping him. That's why Conan goes home when Shinichi comes back, because the BO has been defeated so his parents can take care of him again. What do you think?

[AokoNakamori 24]

i...really don't know

[AJ M. 204]

I just thought of a way Shinichi could tell Ran without revealing to her that he is actually Conan. Note: this will only work if Conan turns back into Shinichi and the BO is defeated. He could tell Ran that he was looking for the BO, and that Conan's parents were helping him. That's why Conan goes home when Shinichi comes back, because the BO has been defeated so his parents can take care of him again. What do you think?

I think it would be best if Shinichi tells Ran the truth about everything - the truth about Conan's identity, the truth about his predicaments, the truth about why he couldn't have told her sooner. But you're idea is plausibly convincing. Ran isn't the smartest bird in the bush, and her gullibility doesn't do her any justice either. I'm pretty sure Ran wouldn't refute any of Shinichi's testimonies about his disappearance; she would rather be on cloud-nine once he returns (if he returns).

But if that were to be the case, wouldn't she want to see Conan again? Would she have the chance to say goodbye to him once Shinichi returns? It's pretty predictable, if not obvious, that Shinichi will eventually tell Ran that he shrunk into the body of a 7-year old boy named Conan. Explaining to Ran that he and Conan are two separate people would only stirrup more trouble and raise even more suspicion as time goes on; therefore, Shinichi will have to tell her sooner or later.

[ZaydenRei 1]

what would really be interesting is (whether or not kudo is returned to a teen or Ran is shrunk)that Kudo has "the detective boys" work for him to help him solve cases, this way they can extend the show past the "resizing" and/or the B.O's disbanding.

BTW: there is atleast 2 episodes where Ran verballp stops conan from darting Mouri... hmmm

[ZaydenRei 1]

BTW: there is atleast 2 episodes where Ran verballp stops conan from darting Mouri... hmmm

[IdentityUnknown 216]

I personally do not want Detective Conan to end... I hope they keep it ongoing...

I personally would rather it end (if it just drags out, readers will get bored and I really do want to see everything fall down with the Org). I wouldn't mind a sequel though. However, it would have to have a new, interesting angle to be able to capture readers' attention.

what would really be interesting is (whether or not kudo is returned to a teen or Ran is shrunk)that Kudo has "the detective boys" work for him to help him solve cases, this way they can extend the show past the "resizing" and/or the B.O's disbanding.

BTW: there is atleast 2 episodes where Ran verballp stops conan from darting Mouri... hmmm

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